{"id":10047,"date":"2026-06-15T23:29:02","date_gmt":"2026-06-15T14:29:02","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/?p=10047"},"modified":"2026-06-15T23:40:45","modified_gmt":"2026-06-15T14:40:45","slug":"the-exit-interview-a-missionary-nuncio-departs-after-a-decade-in-d-c","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/sdgs-2\/the-exit-interview-a-missionary-nuncio-departs-after-a-decade-in-d-c\/","title":{"rendered":"The Exit Interview: A \u2018Missionary\u2019 Nuncio Departs After a Decade in D.C."},"content":{"rendered":"\n
\u2018We talk to everyone \u2014 even the Department of War,\u2019 Cardinal Christophe Pierre says in an exclusive interview about his tenure as the Pope\u2019s man in Washington.<\/pre>\n\n\n\n
By Victor Gaetan<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n
WASHINGTON (INPS Japan\/National Catholic Register)\u2014 As a working Vatican diplomat for close to 50 years, Cardinal Christophe Pierre sat through hundreds of meetings on six continents. So, the fact that he met with U.S. officials at the Department of War in late January (eight days before his 80th birthday) was, in his view, just another \u201cday in the life\u201d of a busy international envoy.\u00a0\uff5cJAPANESE<\/a>\uff5c<\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cThat\u2019s what we do \u2014 we talk to everyone \u2014 even with the Department of War!\u201d Cardinal Pierre exclaimed in conversations with the Register as he prepared a move to Rome from the Holy See\u2019s nunciature, the 1937 purpose-built mansion standing across the street from Vice President J.D. Vance\u2019s residence.\u202f\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Uninterested in spending much time on an event the French-born cardinal considers exaggerated in significance, Cardinal Pierre did confirm that the\u202f\u201cfrank\u201d discussion with Elbridge Colby, undersecretary of\u202fdefense\u202ffor policy, revealed clear differences in this administration\u2019s worldview and the Holy See\u2019s outlook. It also demonstrated, he thinks, a break with past American policy when diplomatic matters were handled by the State Department, not the War Department. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
A Half-Century on the Frontlines<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Ranging in conversation between nations and papacies (his first assignment, to New Zealand, came under Pope Paul VI), chuckling often, Cardinal Pierre exemplifies the extraordinary dedication of the Church\u2019s priest-diplomats. A list of countries where he served only begins to suggest his wide experience: Mozambique, Zimbabwe, Cuba, Brazil, Switzerland, Haiti, Uganda, Mexico, and finally, the U.S.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\"A
A portrait of Cardinal Christophe Pierre, by American portrait artist Igor V. Babailov, is displayed at the papal nunciature in Washington, D.C.<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n
Diverse\u202ftasks included campaigning in Uganda for abstinence education against a vice president\u2019s promotion of condom use as the only way to stop AIDS; taking charge of the nunciature in Burundi after the nuncio was murdered; managing the laicization of Haiti\u2019s Jean-Bertrand Aristide, elected president of his country as a Catholic priest;\u202fnegotiating successfully the inclusion of religious freedom into Mexico\u2019s constitution; and managing the unprecedented demand by his predecessor, Archbishop Carlo Vigan\u00f2, that Pope Francis\u202fresign. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Since he arrived in Washington in 2016, the archbishop has worked simultaneously with the U.S. bishops \u2014 both as individuals in their dioceses and through the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops (USCCB); with the full range of Catholic institutions, especially universities; and as the pope\u2019s main interlocutor with the U.S. government. It\u2019s a huge job, especially because Cardinal Pierre decided he should crisscross the country, to see the Church in its reality. One of a nuncio\u2019s most important duties is to help the Holy Father select new bishops, which requires understanding what they face on the ground. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cJust one day after arriving at the nunciature from Mexico, where I was a nuncio for nine years, I took a flight to Orange County, California, to assist at my first plenary of bishops. So, I was never the typical Washington tourist,\u201d he told me. \u201cD.C. has been a place between travels. As soon as I arrived back in D.C., I was planning my next trip.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
The now-retired nuncio plans to take up residence in Rome and will continue to take on special diplomatic assignments from the Pope. Asked what he will remember most fondly of his time in America, Cardinal Pierre quickly responded, \u201cI certainly enjoyed the people \u2014 the hospitality and generosity of the people. As representative of the pope, I was in touch with a lot of Catholics \u2014 20% of the population! I\u2019ve been to most of the dioceses. Four or five times to Alaska.\u202fHawaii. I enjoyed the snow. I enjoyed California. I enjoyed Florida! I\u2019ve been to Phoenix.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cThe beauty!\u201d he enthused. \u201cThe diversity of the country!\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
What the cardinal enjoyed about the nunciature was its atmosphere of quiet and contemplation. Surrounded by forest, the backyard attracts deer and raccoons. He also appreciated the city\u2019s museums. But mainly, Cardinal Pierre focused on his central task, which was, for most of his tenure, \u201cTo explain Pope Francis to the U.S. and the U.S. to Pope Francis.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Unpacking Aparecida and the Continent of Hope<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
When Cardinal Pierre arrived, he was surprised that American Church leadership was unfamiliar with the Aparecida\u202fconcluding document\u202fproduced by Latin American bishops in 2007. It calls for a more mission-oriented Church dedicated to evangelizing the world;\u202fPope Francis was its lead editor. Many of the themes found in Francis\u2019 first papal exhortation,\u202fEvangelii Gaudium<\/em>, can be traced back to Aparecida.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
According to Cardinal Pierre, to understand the importance of Aparecida, one must see it in the context of the Second Vatican Council. \u201cThe history of the Church is made of some 20 great councils and in the last century, the great event, the event of the Spirit, is Vatican II,\u201d he explained.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cSince the early 1960s, the bishops of South America \u2014 remember Pope Paul VI called it the continent of hope \u2014 these bishops implemented the Second Vatican Council by organizing five big meetings. Aparecida was the fifth one. It occurred after the fall of the Berlin Wall and the end of the imposition of this strange and terrible ideology, Marxism,\u201d he said. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cAt Aparecida, the bishops looked at the breakdown in the transmission of faith and values, the fragmentation of society, modernism, postmodernism, etcetera. Phenomena which have been analyzed by many philosophers and observers. So, the bishops said, now we need to start again and of course to start again from Christ, to evangelize this new world.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
 The cardinal calls this event \u201ca turning point of this century.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
He believes the Holy Spirit inspired the South American bishops, gathered at the continent\u2019s most popular pilgrimage site, the Cathedral Basilica of the National Shrine of Our Lady\u202fAparecida\u202fin\u202fAparecida, Brazil. Through the election of Pope Francis, the insights from\u202fAparecida\u202fentered the universal Church especially in the text of\u202fEvangelii Gaudium<\/em>. And this Spirit is still working today, in Cardinal Pierre\u2019s view. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cThis is why, personally,\u201d he summarized, \u201cI made one of the purposes of my mission in the U.S., to share what I perceived about Pope Francis and Aparecida with the bishops of the United States.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre was beginning his tenure as nuncio to Mexico in 2007, when Jorge Bergoglio was archbishop of Buenos Aires. \u201cPope Francis was a prophet, speaking about what it means to be Church in a changing era, a change of epoch. He offered a diagnosis and focused on the ways to evangelize today. For me this has been fascinating.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
The cardinal sees Pope Leo XIV carrying forward the Spirit expressed in 2007. \u201cWhen you read and listen to the Holy Father, he is in total continuity with what Francis began. Each week, he speaks about Vatican II and the next consistory will be a discussion of\u202fEvangelii Gaudium<\/em>. You see!\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cPope Leo is first and foremost a Latino bishop,\u201d laughed Pierre. \u201cA bishop born in America but a Latino bishop and when you say that you know, you say everything about Pope Leo, but you also say everything about America! Sometimes people don\u2019t want to recognize it.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre describes both Francis and Leo as prophets. Why? \u201cA prophet is the one who speaks about the Gospel. Pope Leo does not want to become a politician. He said so explicitly. The prophet is the one who in the world today, announces the good news of the Gospel,\u201d he explained.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cA prophet must have good vision and he must be courageous, and he must be also able to dialogue with the world today. To propose the presence of Christ and Gospel values to the world today \u2014 this is what Pope Leo does, in a very precise, very kind, and convincing way.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Does Cardinal Pierre believe the U.S. bishops now understand the value of Aparecida, a statement now almost 20 years old?\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cIn the world, nothing is perfect, but I would say yes,\u201d he responded solemnly. \u201cI don\u2019t want to be the advocate of just one document. What is important is that when I hear my brother bishops defending the poor, defending the migrants, defending human life, standing against the death penalty, I\u2019m happy because I believe the bishops are following Jesus, and I thank God for that.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Ideology vs. Reality in the American Church<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre has not always been complimentary toward the American bishops. Some 10 years ago, he was known to criticize the American Catholic Church for excessive ideology. Asked if that was his diagnosis of Church leadership in 2016, the cardinal explained that first, one must understand why ideology is problematic.\u202f\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cThe danger of ideology is that it is very polarizing because you become the owner of an idea and you want to impose it and you forget aspects of reality,\u201d he explained. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Reality is more important than ideas, he reminds me. \u201cIt is much simpler to manage an ideology because you become the owner of the ideology and you think that those who do not agree with you should be forgotten or ignored or defeated. This is what happens all over the world, but it is also a danger within the Church.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
He continued, \u201cIn some ways, Catholicism in the U.S. became a kind of political party, defending values, and they did it well, but it became a kind of political fight. To be Catholic meant defending values. Pope Francis looked at this situation and said, \u2018Be careful. As a Church, we are not\u202fjust<\/em>defending values, even if they are good values.\u2019\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
In this assessment, U.S. Catholic leadership became identified with the pro-life movement as an ideology, which meant other priorities were forgotten. The risk is that this focus contributes to a culture war.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre summarized, \u201cFor many years this cultural war took over and created divisions. Inevitably, the attitude grows, If you are not with me, you are against me.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
And now? \u201cThe bishops are more united today, looking at many aspects of reality. When you function in ideology you are divided,\u201d he said.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Asked what he came to admire about the American Church, Cardinal Pierre emphasizes how productive and giving the Church is. \u201cWhen you look at\u202fwhat Catholics have done, building incredible churches, thriving parishes, universities, hospitals \u2014 it is fantastic! The beauty of Catholicism in America, for more than 200 years, is this generosity. There\u2019s a positive influence of the Church everywhere.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cI don\u2019t know any other country where the contributions of Catholic people to the country are so dramatic. And you know the courage \u2026 when you think that Americans are immigrants. They come from somewhere else. And these people have been able to transform their own country by their own efforts, and they continue to do so,\u201d he said.\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre singled out the Catholic focus on education. \u201cI was made a doctor at Notre Dame University. What a wonderful campus. We have nearly 200 Catholic universities. It\u2019s a wonder!\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
He observed, \u201cAmerican culture became the culture of dreams and the people who came here came to free themselves. The American dream is almost a religion, deeply marked by Protestantism. Catholics invested especially in education so they could be part of the American dream, while remaining deeply rooted in faith.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
The Mystery of Schism and the Call to Peace<\/h3>\n\n\n\n
No honest interview can avoid painful topics. For the nuncio, his tenure\u2019s most difficult passage was the scandal provoked by his predecessor, Archbishop Vigan\u00f2, who called for the pope\u2019s resignation in 2018.  <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Responding to the question of why Vigan\u00f2 went into schism, which led to his excommunication in 2024: \u201cI have not spoken much about that because I am still puzzled by the attitude of my brother, because he is still my brother [bishop],\u201d the cardinal said. \u201cI\u2019ve known him for a long time. I respect him but I have been puzzled. I cannot understand.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cYou know, this is the mystery in life, now that I\u2019m near the end of my life, at age 80,\u201d the French prelate mused. \u201cI have been confronted by many kinds of mystery but the biggest mystery involves human beings. Of course you know, no one is perfect. But I have not understood the position of this, my brother. So, I don\u2019t want to elaborate more about that but certainly it has been troubling for me.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre added that, like the saint from his home region, St. Th\u00e9r\u00e8se of Lisieux, from Normandy, he considers the Church his home. \u201cShe used to say, \u2018My mother the Church\u2019 and I say the same. I have served five popes during my life.\u202fI\u2019ve always seen the work of God in the Church.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre received his red hat at the same time as Archbishop Pierbattista Pizzaballa and Archbishop Robert Prevost. Historically, few nuncios have been created cardinals, but Francis honored several nuncios with this honor, especially those who were missionaries in dangerous or challenging circumstances. I asked the cardinal if Francis considered him to be a bishop serving in\u202fthe U.S. as a missionary land<\/em>. <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cI don\u2019t know why I was made a cardinal,\u201d he responded. \u201cIt was exceptional. I had a good relationship with Pope Francis. I\u2019ve believed strongly in the importance of this pope. He certainly gave a lot of attention to the U.S. Typically, South Americans, especially the elite, they pay a lot of attention to North America, what\u2019s going on there \u2014 not the contrary. North America should pay more attention to what is happening in South America. I was so privileged to live in both places. To me, Pope Leo is more Latin than American.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
U.S. Foreign Policy  <\/h3>\n\n\n\n
Returning to the here and now, I asked the nuncio what caused officials from the Department of War to summon him to meet on Jan. 22. \u201cIt was definitely related to Pope Leo\u2019s\u202fspeech to the diplomats\u202fwhen he said, \u2018War is back in vogue and a zeal for war is spreading.\u2019\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre added, \u201cPope Leo\u2019s main emphasis has been peace. The first word he used from the balcony after his election was \u2018peace.\u2019 He has been constant in that theme.\u201d\u202f <\/p>\n\n\n\n
 According to the nuncio, the Holy See is very concerned that the Trump administration\u2019s foreign policy approach turns away from policies advocated since World War II \u2014 policies that helped create the United Nations. \u201cWe found several disturbing things in the U.S. National Security Strategy\u202freleased late last year,\u201d said Cardinal Pierre. \u201cIt extols the Law of Force, not the force of law. It leaves little room for constructive multilateralism, while the pope continues the classical conception of diplomacy.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
He continued with emotion, \u201cThe real history of America is that it built institutions for dialogue. But now you say no to dialogue? You destroy people then offer to engage in dialogue after that? It will never happen. Trump wants to isolate America and make America great against the others. Before, America became great\u202fwith <\/em>the others. And this is why America became great\u2014with the others.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
Cardinal Pierre pointed out that the Pope did not initiate a discussion of \u201cjust war,\u201d but others evoked this Catholic concept. Rather, \u201cLeo just said: No to war.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
\u201cThe current war in Iran can\u2019t be considered a just war,\u201d explained the diplomat, \u201cbecause it is not a defensive war. You don\u2019t go to war to negotiate. You go to negotiate to avoid war.\u201d <\/p>\n\n\n\n
“What has happened lately, with the pope mentioned almost every day\u202fby the president,\u202fdemonstrates that people are discovering the pope in a positive way because what he says makes sense.”  <\/p>\n\n\n\n
He concluded, “Ironically, the president\u2019s attacks boost the\u202fpositive image\u202fof Pope Leo and the Catholic Church.” —<\/p>\n\n\n
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\"Victor<\/figure>\n<\/div>\n\n\n
Victor Gaetan<\/a> Victor Gaetan is a senior correspondent for the National Catholic Register, focusing on international issues. He also writes for Foreign Affairs magazine<\/a>, The American Spectator<\/a> and the Washington Examiner<\/a>. He contributed to Catholic News Service for several years. The Catholic Press Association of North America has given his articles four first place awards, including Individual Excellence, over the last five years. Gaetan received a license (B.A.) in Ottoman and Byzantine Studies from Sorbonne University in Paris, an M.A. from the Fletcher School of International Law and Diplomacy, and a Ph.D. in Ideology in Literature from Tufts University. His book God\u2019s Diplomats: Pope Francis, Vatican Diplomacy, and America\u2019s Armageddon<\/em> was published by Rowman & Littlefield in July 2021. Visit his website at VictorGaetan.org<\/a>. This article was published with author\u2019s permission.<\/p>\n\n\n\n
Original URL: The Exit Interview: A \u2018Missionary\u2019 Nuncio Departs After a Decade in D.C.| National Catholic Register<\/a><\/p>\n\n\n\n
INPS Japan<\/p>\n\n\n\n
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\u2018We talk to everyone \u2014 even the Department of War,\u2019 Cardinal Christophe Pierre says in an exclusive interview about his tenure as the Pope\u2019s man in Washington. By Victor Gaetan WASHINGTON (INPS Japan\/National Catholic Register)\u2014 As a working Vatican diplomat for close to 50 years, Cardinal Christophe Pierre sat through hundreds of meetings on six […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":10048,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[26,40,56,16,24,32,3],"tags":[],"class_list":{"0":"post-10047","1":"post","2":"type-post","3":"status-publish","4":"format-standard","5":"has-post-thumbnail","7":"category-culture-art-religion","8":"category-global-regions","9":"category-goal16","10":"category-news","11":"category-politic-conflict-peace","12":"category-regions","13":"category-sdgs-2"},"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/10047","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=10047"}],"version-history":[{"count":3,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/10047\/revisions"}],"predecessor-version":[{"id":10053,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/10047\/revisions\/10053"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/10048"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=10047"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=10047"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/inpsjapan.com\/en\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=10047"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}